If everything is part of God's plan, can anything be bad? evil even?
Question:
Sexual predators preying on children.
Enron leaving workers and investors broke.
Does God look upon this as part of his ultimate plan and say it's all good?
Or is it that "God" (if you think that way) is not omniscient because that directly conflicts with the idea of free will?
You can't really have it both ways, omniscient God and people with free will.
So going with the premise of omniscient God, can anything be considered bad if it's in the plan? I mean that makes it all necessary, not bad or evil.
Answer:
This is a problem common to most attempts at theodicy (the problem of evil).
What it boils down to is that omniscience, omnipotence, and omnibenevolence together are contradictory.
"Free will" defenses are lame for many reasons, including that Christian theology claims there will be a perfect heaven someday (yet with free will), plus the fact that no one chooses for thousands to millions of people to suffer and die of disease and natural disasters every year.
sisterzeal, is your god too weak to stop your devil from running around torturing innocent people, or does your god simply think it's funny?
Everything is not part of God's plan. God didn't plan for Adam and Eve to eat of the forbidden fruit. Do you plan for you car to be stolen if you leave it in a dark parking lot. Even if you lock it?
Remember what the fundies were screaming after the WTC attacks:
'9/11 was gods punishment for America allowing homosexuals to live here'.
Then remind yourself that anyone who believes in the existence of 'gods plan' is a moron.
God's omniscience doesn't preclude our free will. What makes you think that it would?
Yes, God's plan was that evil should exist alongside with good on this earth, giving us a choice. No choice, no free will.
If, as theologians suggest, the word good is really just a synonym for godly and everything is God's doing...then it necessarily follows that everything must be seen as "good."
this is a question we all ask. God's plan seems to involve sacrificing. If you reach up to him and your left broke or molested and so on, then there is a major problem.
I think that just because God is omnipotent (omniscience doesn't matter here...), it doesn't mean he's going to USE that power to decide things for us. It's kind of like a parent who sees a child about to foul up; sometimes, assuming it's not going to be a deadly thing, you have to stand back and let them fall on their faces to learn a lesson. I think God makes a practice of letting us try and fail; it doesn't mean he couldn't intervene, only that he doesn't.
Obviously the things you mention are not good; but they are part of what you get when you have free will.
God is love. God is good and he is the only good there is. Good is not absolute.
There was a war in heaven and bad was created by a being that had the power to create.
Today on earth we deal with the results of that war.... and furthermore there will be another war.
The next war will be like the first war but this time bad will be defeated. Everyone who survives that war will enjoy good.... without end.
Well, god is either omnipotent and not nice because he causes all these things.
Or he is not omnipotent and so not much use because he cannot stop them.
Or he just isn't there.
Well satan is behind it all.
How we deal with it as Christians is a test and a study guide for satan and his demons and angels. How are we doing?
Everything isn't a part of God's plan! I would have trouble believing in a God that toyed with humans by sending good and bad their way just so they could try to find the silver lining in it.
The fact is, bad things like earthquakes, etc. happen because we live in an abnormal world made so by the first humans’ choice to revolt against God. God isn’t the author of suffering, we as freely chosing creatures are. When we live outside of God’s design and plan, bad things will happen.
The question on an omniscent (all knowing) God assumes that God thinks linearly as we do. God exists outside of time, existing in the forever now. God sees everything in an instant, the beginning and the end. So for example at the same time God decided to create Adam and Eve as morally free agents, he also knew that he would need to redeem his creatures.
Most people don’t have a real problem with believing in both human free will and an omniscient diety. Since God is omniscient, God knows what you will choose to do. But since God also gave you free will, this knowledge does not mean that your choice is not free.
You can have it both ways...are you a parent? As a parent, we teach our children the difference between right and wrong, hoping they listen, sometimes they do, sometimes they don't...but we also know there is going to come a time in their lives, when each of them have to venture out on their own and take the knowledge we have tried to give them, and make their own decisions, and either reap the rewards, or pay the consequences of those decisions...eventually, we become more like our parents...
God is our Heavenly Father, He sent us here to make choices, so we could learn for ourselves what is true happiness...if we choose wisely, we will become more like Him...
as bad things happen to us, because of either our own sin or the sins of others, Heavenly Father can change bad things into things that are for our betterment, but we have to let Him do this, it is not automatic...we have a choice...Christ's atonement helps us make that choice...
I am sure it makes God sad that satan is hell-bent on destroying everything good, but God also knows that for us to experience both good AND evil was the only way for us to learn for ourselves and to grow spiritually...
This does not make God any less omnipotent, just like it doesn't diminish our abilities as a parent to let our kids make their own choices...
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